Barring these two teams placement...

[andy]

In the brackets...

Tennessee and Kansas for the National Championship if they are placed on opposite sides.

Hands down.

[silverbullet97]

Tennessee has the depth and the talent but they had better find some discipline if they want a title. Poor free throw shooting and rebounding are going to kill them. Personally, I think they need another post presence to win a title. Someone that can keep an opposing team from getting too many offensive rebounds. From what I saw of the Ohio State games with Tennessee and UNC this year, UNC is a better team (When they have Lawson). Tennessee is a fun team to watch. I am excited for their game against Memphis. But they have some work to do to be a legit title contender even though the talent is there.

Kansas is one of those teams that seems like they should be there every year but never quite seem to get over the hump. I see no reason why this could not be their year.

[andy]

You must not have watched the UF vs UT game last night...

[silverbullet97]

I watched a little, I did however watch Tennesee struggle to put a away a Buckeye team that had no business being as close as they were. I have watched Tennessee brick its way to less than 65% foul shooting. I watched a soft Ohio State team out rebound the Vols. There is no question they are talented but they have major flaws in rebounding the ball and in shooting the free throw. A team with a decent post presence (I am looking at you Pat Patterson) catches UT on an off shooting night and UT is done. That is what happened to them versus Kentucky and will likely happen again unless UT starts showing more discipline.

UT reminds me of a less disciplined version of the 05 fighting Illini.

[georgiabuckeye]

I think the Vols are very vulnerable. Ohio State is not very good at this point and looked Great against Florida, and should have beaten UT when they played if not for a cold streak late in the game.

The UF UT game does not tell me mutch because which UF team showed up?

[andy]

silverbullet97 said:

I watched a little, I did however watch Tennesee struggle to put a away a Buckeye team that had no business being as close as they were. I have watched Tennessee brick its way to less than 65% foul shooting. I watched a soft Ohio State team out rebound the Vols. There is no question they are talented but they have major flaws in rebounding the ball and in shooting the free throw. A team with a decent post presence (I am looking at you Pat Patterson) catches UT on an off shooting night and UT is done. That is what happened to them versus Kentucky and will likely happen again unless UT starts showing more discipline.

UT reminds me of a less disciplined version of the 05 fighting Illini.

When OSU played the Vols, OSU had the luxury of a very cold, Chris Lofton. Chris Lofton is arguably the best inside/outside guard in the country. He has finally elevated his game to where it should be this season and is doing it with authority. So that game is a very tainted image of the Tennessee team you see today.

As for free throws, they have shot very well from the strike the past couple weeks, even going over 70% a couple times. With the exception of the Georgia game, they have been spot on with the best.

For lack of size and how OSU out rebounded them, of course they did. OSU is taller than Tennessee. They don't have a true big man, but that doesn't stop them one bit. Funny that you mention Patterson as a post presence. Patterson IS the post presence at Kentucky, they essentially play a 4G 1F look. He isn't the ends all of post play either. Chism, and Crews are more than capable of playing inside for Tennessee, and have done so with teams with a larger inside presence, ala Florida.

We have a true big man, undersized, but he is a big man, with a solid 2-3 rotation at F to play aside of him... Tennessee out rebounded Florida, and almost half of them were offensive boards. To me, they are MORE than capable of cleaning up the boards.

You also underestimate their defensive abilities. They average over 10 steals per game. Florida had 20 Turnovers that game, 14 steals. Their defense is very stout and they are deep in the guard position so you can't wear them out.

After seeing them play my Gators, there is no doubt who the best team in the SEC is. The best team in the SEC has done pretty well the past few years. Remember, this Tennessee team, the very exact one with the exception of Tyler Smith from Iowa, beat the Back to Back National Champions 3-1 times. This is a better team than last year, much better. They will go very deep into the tournament.

Mind you, they went 3-1 against Al Horford, and Joakim Noah inside, arguably the best front court tandem since 2000, with the same "lack of inside presence" you assume is there now.

Just my thoughts.

[andy]

georgiabuckeye said:

I think the Vols are very vulnerable. Ohio State is not very good at this point and looked Great against Florida, and should have beaten UT when they played if not for a cold streak late in the game.

The UF UT game does not tell me mutch because which UF team showed up?

Are the Vols vulnerable?

Of course. But this is a team that went down early, 16-3 At home to the Gators, and still mustered up 44 points to stay in the game to a Florida team who was shooting a unimaginable percentage in the first half.

Florida shot decent and put themselves in a position to win. Hell 82 points would beat most B10, and BE teams around the country any given night. But the last 5 minutes showed Florida's youth, and lack of depth. I counted 8 turnovers in the last 5 minutes, with at least 3 , 3 pointers coming off of them.

It's no "which Florida team showed up". I'll tell you. The Florida team that shot 54% the entire game, and still came up 22 points short. It's a very rare thing when that happens. It was because of Tennessee's determination, depth, and defense in the second half that Florida was a 22 point defeated team that night. Not because we didn't show up.

It was Tennessee. They COMPLETELY shut down our high double pick and roll in the second half, which was racking us up the points. Made the turnovers when needed, and finished off the game like a veteran team does.

This team will go to the NC game if they are on the opposite side of Kansas.

[silverbullet97]

andy said:

silverbullet97 said:

I watched a little, I did however watch Tennesee struggle to put a away a Buckeye team that had no business being as close as they were. I have watched Tennessee brick its way to less than 65% foul shooting. I watched a soft Ohio State team out rebound the Vols. There is no question they are talented but they have major flaws in rebounding the ball and in shooting the free throw. A team with a decent post presence (I am looking at you Pat Patterson) catches UT on an off shooting night and UT is done. That is what happened to them versus Kentucky and will likely happen again unless UT starts showing more discipline.

UT reminds me of a less disciplined version of the 05 fighting Illini.

When OSU played the Vols, OSU had the luxury of a very cold, Chris Lofton. Chris Lofton is arguably the best inside/outside guard in the country. He has finally elevated his game to where it should be this season and is doing it with authority. So that game is a very tainted image of the Tennessee team you see today.

As for free throws, they have shot very well from the strike the past couple weeks, even going over 70% a couple times. With the exception of the Georgia game, they have been spot on with the best.

For lack of size and how OSU out rebounded them, of course they did. OSU is taller than Tennessee. They don't have a true big man, but that doesn't stop them one bit. Funny that you mention Patterson as a post presence. Patterson IS the post presence at Kentucky, they essentially play a 4G 1F look. He isn't the ends all of post play either. Chism, and Crews are more than capable of playing inside for Tennessee, and have done so with teams with a larger inside presence, ala Florida.

We have a true big man, undersized, but he is a big man, with a solid 2-3 rotation at F to play aside of him... Tennessee out rebounded Florida, and almost half of them were offensive boards. To me, they are MORE than capable of cleaning up the boards.

You also underestimate their defensive abilities. They average over 10 steals per game. Florida had 20 Turnovers that game, 14 steals. Their defense is very stout and they are deep in the guard position so you can't wear them out.

After seeing them play my Gators, there is no doubt who the best team in the SEC is. The best team in the SEC has done pretty well the past few years. Remember, this Tennessee team, the very exact one with the exception of Tyler Smith from Iowa, beat the Back to Back National Champions 3-1 times. This is a better team than last year, much better. They will go very deep into the tournament.

Mind you, they went 3-1 against Al Horford, and Joakim Noah inside, arguably the best front court tandem since 2000, with the same "lack of inside presence" you assume is there now.

Just my thoughts.

See here is my problem. Ohio State is tall but soft in the middle. Kentucky as you said has only the one post presence. yet both teams did well against them. What happens when they run into a team with a really good post presence.

Regarding Ohio State's game against UT being tainted because Lofton has a cold night... Cold nights are part of the game and that is my point. From a talent and experience perspective they should have blown Ohio State out. even with a terrible game by Lofton. Think about it. They have more talent, more experience, more depth, and had way more motivation yet they could not put them away.

Teams built like Tennessee tend to struggle late in the tournament as their shooters begin to lose their legs. To make the tournament finals they will HAVE to find ways to prevent teams from getting easy put backs (this is their biggest weakness. What happens if they play Georgetown, Texas A&M, Texas (again). If a team like Ohio State can out rebound UT then these teams will have no trouble in the post against the Vols. Heck Butler killed Ohio State on the boards, what if Lofton is cold in a game against them?

In terms of talent, they are clearly one of the top teams in the nation. But if you don't rebound well and don't hit free throws well that spells a lack of discipline. And that does not bode well for a team that really should be challenging for the title.

PS. be careful about SEC pride this year. Of the major conferences, the SEC is only better than the Big Ten. And based on "On court" performances they are only marginally better.

[silverbullet97]

silverbullet97 said:

andy said:

When OSU played the Vols, OSU had the luxury of a very cold, Chris Lofton. Chris Lofton is arguably the best inside/outside guard in the country. He has finally elevated his game to where it should be this season and is doing it with authority. So that game is a very tainted image of the Tennessee team you see today.

As for free throws, they have shot very well from the strike the past couple weeks, even going over 70% a couple times. With the exception of the Georgia game, they have been spot on with the best.

For lack of size and how OSU out rebounded them, of course they did. OSU is taller than Tennessee. They don't have a true big man, but that doesn't stop them one bit. Funny that you mention Patterson as a post presence. Patterson IS the post presence at Kentucky, they essentially play a 4G 1F look. He isn't the ends all of post play either. Chism, and Crews are more than capable of playing inside for Tennessee, and have done so with teams with a larger inside presence, ala Florida.

We have a true big man, undersized, but he is a big man, with a solid 2-3 rotation at F to play aside of him... Tennessee out rebounded Florida, and almost half of them were offensive boards. To me, they are MORE than capable of cleaning up the boards.

You also underestimate their defensive abilities. They average over 10 steals per game. Florida had 20 Turnovers that game, 14 steals. Their defense is very stout and they are deep in the guard position so you can't wear them out.

After seeing them play my Gators, there is no doubt who the best team in the SEC is. The best team in the SEC has done pretty well the past few years. Remember, this Tennessee team, the very exact one with the exception of Tyler Smith from Iowa, beat the Back to Back National Champions 3-1 times. This is a better team than last year, much better. They will go very deep into the tournament.

Mind you, they went 3-1 against Al Horford, and Joakim Noah inside, arguably the best front court tandem since 2000, with the same "lack of inside presence" you assume is there now.

Just my thoughts.

See here is my problem. Ohio State is tall but soft in the middle. Kentucky as you said has only the one post presence. yet both teams did well against them. What happens when they run into a team with a really good post presence.

Regarding Ohio State's game against UT being tainted because Lofton has a cold night... Cold nights are part of the game and that is my point. From a talent and experience perspective they should have blown Ohio State out. even with a terrible game by Lofton. Think about it. They have more talent, more experience, more depth, and had way more motivation yet they could not put them away.

Teams built like Tennessee tend to struggle late in the tournament as their shooters begin to lose their legs. To make the tournament finals they will HAVE to find ways to prevent teams from getting easy put backs (this is their biggest weakness. What happens if they play Georgetown, Texas A&M, Texas (again). If a team like Ohio State can out rebound UT then these teams will have no trouble in the post against the Vols. Heck Butler killed Ohio State on the boards, what if Lofton is cold in a game against them?

In terms of talent, they are clearly one of the top teams in the nation. But if you don't rebound well and don't hit free throws well that spells a lack of discipline. And that does not bode well for a team that really should be challenging for the title.

PS. be careful about SEC pride this year. Of the major conferences, the SEC is only better than the Big Ten. And based on "On court" performances they are only marginally better.

This is exactly what I was talking about. Butler took Tenn to over time and is tied with 2:15 left. While I fully expect the Vol's to win this game, it shows they they are vulnerable. Still the Vols are so freaking exciting it isnt even funny.

[andy]

See, Tennessee has the toughest road to the Ship out of all of the teams...

With Georgetown going down today, that helps them, but their weakness is the inside game. They would have had to play Louisville (great inside) and then North Carolina (great inside), then once more in Georgetown... Their road got a little easier, but they still have to get out of their bracket to have a chance. I think if they can get out of the bracket, and into the final four, they will matchup better and will be a better team overall for facing those tough inside presense teams in Louisville and UNC.

[andy]

I will remind you, this essentially same Butler team gave Florida fits last year too. AJ Graves is the real deal.

[silverbullet97]

I totally agree that the Vols got hosed on their draw. They were the strongest of he 2 seeds and should have been matched against the weakest of the 1 seeds.

And I agree on the second point as well Butler as a team is solid.

[silverbullet97]

Well I did not expect them to bow out this early. Wow!

[BlockONation]

Tennessee has never been past the sweet 16 and Patino is personally now 14-0 vs Tennessee....I totally expected it!

[Andrew - Resident Gator]

silverbullet97 said:

Well I did not expect them to bow out this early. Wow!

Me either...

But they did have the hardest road out of all of the 2 seeds... Tennessee and Texas should have been switched.